RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Hurley said:
Oh boy. This was for me on a similar level as The Host, maybe worse. Everything was predictable, the scenes in the bunker were underused and after last weeks episode briliant directing, this time... not so much. I liked the ending though... But not much else.
I agree. The scenes in the bunker was great but underused. I just feel this episode was written as a video game : Evil will stop spreading as soon they clear the stage boss (Lem). Why the evil stop spreading like that for no reason? Why everyone is safe suddenly? I think they should continue the carnage until no one left or they find a way to push it back temporary. There's also a Walking Dead flavor to this episode.
a lot of good gore scene but I think the writers cut corners. Enjoyable episode overall with some major flaws.
Now I just think Kelly should die. The character is more annoying than anything. "Comon I'll kill you myself" line was pretty useless. She don't bring what the character need to be. I mean she lost her family. She should be more emotive. She didn't cried, she's never totally in anger when she kill a deadite. There's definitively something missing in this character. Not intense as it should be IMO. This role was not for this actress.
Also agree with Guywiththegun40. They need to go back with a full Joe Loduca score on the series. Rock songs were cool in the first episode and in the car scenes but now it just kill the tone.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
IN-DEPTH REVIEW (PRO'S,MIDDLE'S AND CON'S)
i have a lot to say about this episode, some of it being mixed and one part of it feeling disappointing, overall this episode will probably be low on list overall which sucks to say but this one felt rushed out the door so they could get into the cabin arc quickly. I thought it was a good entertaining filler episode but the flaws that were in this episode are just to big to ignore
PRO'S
Pablo and Kelly's scenes
Ash actually trying to be sentimental towards his friends and trying to talk them out of going to cabin before ultimately taking off towards the cabin without them.
The gore and kills were on point in this episode and i'm starting to see less and less of the cgi.
The teamwork ash and amanda did in the final fight with lem. (only part i liked about there story together)
The sidekicks downplaying the cabin and ash's warning about them coming to the cabin. It's gonna be so sweet seeing the cabin f*ck with them so badly it's not even gonna be funny and im just gonna be sitting there like "Hey ash told you it was dangerous but nope didn't listen"
MIDDLE'S
Ruby's resurrection scene was great but we were told by the description of this episode we would be getting more out of what ruby's mission would be and that obviously didn't happen. (I'm really starting to suspect that they have extended versions of these episodes and will be apart of the box set when it comes out)
Lems deadite was probably the worst and most dumbest deadite i've seen yet, but i felt it was intentionally done.
The Final shot of this episode was just chilling to see but it should have been done with Joseph's score, it would have added to it a lot more.
CON'S ( *RANT INCOMING* )
Ash and amanda's relationship
The writing and overall chemistry between these two just made me wanna gag on a spoon, bruce tries with all his might to get it to stick but it's the writing and overall acting for amanda's character that just drags this subplot down into the trash. I get what they were trying to go for with it and that's a cheesy type of relationship but it just ultimately just falls on it's ass because of the writing of her character and overall execution by the actress, it almost seems like she's being setup to be a throwaway character and quite honestly i think this show will be better off without her around.
Amanda
Amanda really rubbed me the wrong way for some reason this episode, she just come's off as this snarky asshole towards the end of it and the kerosene line towards ash after he just poured his gut's out to them was just mean as hell and i legit cheered when ash left them in the dust at the end of this episode.
The Walking Deadite's
I do have to agree with everyone else that the deadites have been weakened down and they get killed quite quickly in this TV SHOW, but i'm still holding out that they amp them back up for the cabin arc and we really get to seem them come at ash and his pals full force for these final three episodes.
IN-SUMMARY
This one was really mixed bag for me and will probably be really low on my list for top episodes this season, it was a good entertaining filler episode before the cabin and made me laugh in some parts but some moments of it just put me in a sour mood. Don't really have any observations or theory's for this week's episode, but the one thing i am excited to see is probably ash and ruby finally meeting, i can't wait to see how they play off each other.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
And back with fuller thoughts:
Pros:
* Kelly's development into a bloodthirsty Deadite killer who wants to char the shit out of Deadites with flamethrowers.
* Ash's Inspector Gadget -like glove.
* It was nice to see Pablo be in peril and Kelly saving his butt for once. It was a nice tit-for-tat moment, but I am not feeling the shipper love like I want to still, they're screaming brother and sister at me.
* Ash's line about how everybody he loves dies when they go to the cabin. Beautiful character development. Actually revelatory. It also comes way too late in the narrative for people to care.
* Lem was a good Deadite with a unique set of skills.
* Whatever antics we get with Ash's hand should at least be fun, but HOW is that cabin still exactly intact as it was in thirty years? THERE WAS A HUMAN-SUCKING CYCLONE.
* The camaraderie between the ghostbeaters was nice.
Reservations:
* The direction was mediocre as heck. It was like a subpar A-Team episode mashed into a Walking Dead episode with more gore. It just felt...mildly fun but formulaic? We know no one in the main cast is going to die, and watching everyone split up like it's Scooby Doo was distracting.
* Y'know, I've tried to back off about complaining about the CGI but CGI ENHANCED FIRE BLOWING? REALLY? Come on guys, that's a bad as the enhanced vomit shot during Kelly's possession.
* That bit where we finally see the cabin and Ash's hand returning to said cabin would've had so much more impact if they hadn't thought it prudent to have the whole cast shoot promos RIGHT NEXT TO THE THING.
* Well, we got the eventual, obligatory Lucy Lawless nude shot tonight. Sidenote - I feel like they ratcheted up the nudity/language content more than usual. This isn't a complaint, but an observation.
Cons:
* Ash and Amanda's love (sex) story is a narrative nadir. Amanda is barely a character, Jill and Bruce's chemistry is non-existent and they are almost literally retracing the slap-slap-kiss relationship of Ash and Sheila word for word, only with more violence. I do not want to watch him 'blow this woman's doors' off. I want to watch Amanda and Ruby kick ass while Ash sleeps with - I don't know, women of the week, something like that. I completely believe that this is the kind of attraction this version of Ash would form, but something feels off. It's...I don't know if the word 'crass' fits, but it feels crass. They just want to fuck each other and maybe they're loosely fond of each other. That's not love, and not rootworthy anywhere outside of a Porkys movie. She is literally on the same emotional level to him as the bar hookup he had in the pilot at this point - why should I care if they screw or not? There was more of an emotional connection between Ash and Sheila because it was handled seriously (Well, in the UK edit), and Ash and Linda wipe the floor with this pairing.
* Seeing Kelly be sure of herself is giving Pablo a crisis of faith? After he just had a perfect moment of clarity after the Brujo arc? What?
* Seriously - WHO IS AMANDA? A tough, independent cop with clever ideas who kills the shit out of things, someone who cowers when faced with incomprehensible evil, somebody who blindly worships a competent but mysterious woman like Ruby, or someone who giggles at Ash's one-liners and wants to play stuff the sausage with him? I know who Kelly and Pablo are, but I have no idea who Amanda is.
* I completely buy that Ash is fond enough of Pablo to want to leave him behind so he'll live, but he's expressed no actual emotion toward Kelly besides vague pride when she's acting like him and he and Amanda are currently on the emotional level of "please screw me, you have big boobs." There needed to be way, way more of a transition between what happened with them in the pilot to his reaction in the possession episode to this.
* Everyone standing around snickering about the dead militia members while stealing their stuff. At least Kelly's family and Pablo's uncle got a sense of dignity attached to their deaths, but the level of "eh, who the hell cares" about the people who died at the Moose and at the camp was off-putting. Sure, they were assholes who tried to kill you - so was Kelly's mom. But you're standing there stealing shit from dead people. Again: it was crass (And yes, I know this is Evil Dead).
* Wait, we were promised Ruby backstory. What happened to it? Did the possession scene get cut?
* Better yet, how did Ruby figure out her car was a the Moose? How did she get from Pablo's uncle's place to the bar? How did she know it would be there?
* Amanda's whole speech about what Ruby did for her. Uh, we saw them have three conversations. Three. If they wanted to make this make sense those conversations should've been shown.
* Kelly's development has also turned her into Scrappy Doo, yelling every other minute about how she wants to fucking splat somebody. At least she can back her shit up but Dana's atonal line reading gets worse when she's yelling.
* Like SC noticed - why was everything suddenly cool when Lem died? Shouldn't there be loose militia members out there?
Observations:
* The Michigander accents were pretty spot on. Also Bruce's assistant/Agent (I still have no idea who he is to him) Mike was one of the militia dudes.
* Are they going to pay off the fact that Amanda can't discern smells like oh, burning bodies and kerosene? Because nobody is that dumb. These things have discernible scents.
@Joe I will laugh my butt off if Starz pushed for censorship when it came to Lucy kissing that ten year old and that's why the backstory got truncated.
It's also possible that the kid shows up at the cabin and that's where it happens, because Bruce did mention killing a child Deadite at one point.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
MaidOfKandar said:
Cons:
* Seeing Kelly be sure of herself is giving Pablo a crisis of faith? After he just had a perfect moment of clarity after the Brujo arc? What?
* Everyone standing around snickering about the dead militia members while stealing their stuff. At least Kelly's family and Pablo's uncle got a sense of dignity attached to their deaths, but the level of "eh, who the hell cares" about the people who died at the Moose and at the camp was off-putting. Sure, they were assholes who tried to kill you - so was Kelly's mom. But you're standing there stealing shit from dead people. Again: it was crass (And yes, I know this is Evil Dead).
Observations:
It's also possible that the kid shows up at the cabin and that's where it happens, because Bruce did mention killing a child Deadite at one point.
1. I think it was more of pablo trying to figure out what his go-to weapon was as kelly already figured out what her's was going to be, and we got that in the form of the magnum revolver (*cough* PABLO GRIMES *cough)
2. I think this part should be blamed on the director of this episode micheal hurst and whoever wrote the script for this episode and how rushed it felt, atleast the past directors and writers tried to add weight to the deaths of the side character's in the early episodes.
And that's why im thinking they were saving the best for last, and this also just show's me that they are really going to push it with the cabin arc episode's if they are bringing in a 10 year old deadite.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
I liked how Ash and Amanda's relationship is starting to happen in this episode. A lot of cutesy moments between them. But to follow it up at the end with Ash wanting to ditch the group because he wants to spare his pack from getting possessed or killed at the cabin. I feel an anterior motive. I think he ditched them the last minute because he fears the last time he survived the cabin he wasn't supposed to. He feels guilty being the only one to have survived that ordeal and wants to go back to let the cabin finish him off as long as it means stopping the rest of the world from going deadite too in a way.
They could have just used the pickaxes to break the lock from the gate that had the sunlight. no need to try to lead the deadite Lem to them before they could get out. That's just taking an unnecessary risk.
Favorite Lines:
Ash: What's out there knows that you're alive and it wants you to be...un-alive.
Pablo: I think I found my boomstick.
Pablo forgot to remind Ash to gas up his chainsaw.in this episode.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Tough crowd. I really enjoyed this episode, and thought the pacing was much better than in any others... and that is in part do to Michael Hurst and the writers which included Sean Clements, Dominic Dierkes and Ivan Raimi. Plus we got a naked Ruby, and I assume that the next couple of episodes will deal with what happened to her along with some other stuff. I also thought Ash and Amanda worked pretty well together, and look forward to seeing where there "relationship" goes. Kelly and Pablo are awesome.
/I think Lem losing his some skin off his head was a bit of an homage to Choptop as played by Bill Moseley who was also in a little movie called Army of Darkness.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Nick el Ass said:
Tough crowd. I really enjoyed this episode, and thought the pacing was much better than in any others... and that is in part do to Michael Hurst and the writers which included Sean Clements, Dominic Dierkes and Ivan Raimi. Plus we got a naked Ruby, and I assume that the next couple of episodes will deal with what happened to her along with some other stuff. I also thought Ash and Amanda worked pretty well together, and look forward to seeing where there "relationship" goes. Kelly and Pablo are awesome.
/I think Lem losing his some skin off his head was a bit of an homage to Choptop as played by Bill Moseley who was also in a little movie called Army of Darkness.
I did enjoy ash and amanda's teamwork together during the final fight with lem, i think i put that as a pro in my review, like i said i thought it was a Good filler episode and was very entertaining but it did have some major problems to it that were just too big to overlook, but i think it was just mostly ash and amanda's relationship and how they executed it felt off to me and it just felt forced for the sake of being forced, and amanda's character overall just really rubbed me the wrong way this episode.
Going to follow in robo rider footstep and pop off my favorite lines from this episode
"I wish i had my rusty chain yo..." - Pablo
"Won't your sister be jealous ?" - Kelly
"Everyone i ever have feelings for die's there...." - Ash (Very Powerful and subtle line)
"Were not leaving a trail of blood and guts behind us, were keeping Michigan moist !" - Kelly
"Yeah, fuck a flamethrower this guy's got girth !" - Kelly
"Oh yeah, i think i just found my boomstick..." - Pablo
"Just so you know, each of you has a very special place in my heart....good job staying alive....keep it up...amen" - Ash (the face he makes after this is just heartbreaking to see)
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
I don't see how it seemed forced. Maybe it was a little fast in that the episodes are so short, and she went from hunting him to sort of falling for him in no time flat. None the less, I thought that the chemistry was perfect between the two... and the little laugh when he spun her around and barked was an honest reaction from Jill that showed it.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Nick el Ass said:
I don't see how it seemed forced. Maybe it was a little fast in that the episodes are so short, and she went from hunting him to sort of falling for him in no time flat. None the less, I thought that the chemistry was perfect between the two... and the little laugh when he spun her around and barked was an honest reaction from Jill that showed it.
True, maybe it was just when i was watching it i didn't really take the time to really pay attention to it, maybe another viewing of the episode is in order for me i guess :-/ .
EDIT
Starz has updated there site with the next episode picture's plus the small clip.
There really keeping what happens in this episode a secret, not alot of juicy info BUT
It looks like the cabin is already playing trick's on ash's mind as there is no way amanda could have found him that quickly, it's gotta be the cabin playing with his head or his imagining things.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Sutter Cane said:
Now I just think Kelly should die. The character is more annoying than anything. "Comon I'll kill you myself" line was pretty useless. She don't bring what the character need to be. I mean she lost her family. She should be more emotive. She didn't cried, she's never totally in anger when she kill a deadite. There's definitively something missing in this character. Not intense as it should be IMO. This role was not for this actress.
I think it would be interesting if both Amanda and Kelly would die at the end of the first season. It would left Pablo broken, similarly to Ash in the movies when Linda died, and Ash would be just like "yeah, I told ya this would happen" and it would be really dark for both of them.
However I don't think this will happen. Either only Amanda dies at the end of the season (the clues are all over the place), or Amanda and Pablo, who would sacrifice himself for Kelly/the group in some "brujo life destiny" manner. And yes, the "dynamic duo" of only Ash and Kelly for the second season (that is before they meet new characters) would be also interesting, but like you said, this character needs to settle down. I'm starting to see Kelly less as someone desperate for vengeance and more as just a crazy sociopat who's a ticking time bomb that will never go off because screenwriting.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Hurley said:
Sutter Cane said:
Now I just think Kelly should die. The character is more annoying than anything. "Comon I'll kill you myself" line was pretty useless. She don't bring what the character need to be. I mean she lost her family. She should be more emotive. She didn't cried, she's never totally in anger when she kill a deadite. There's definitively something missing in this character. Not intense as it should be IMO. This role was not for this actress.
I think it would be interesting if both Amanda and Kelly would die at the end of the first season. It would left Pablo broken, similarly to Ash in the movies when Linda died, and Ash would be just like "yeah, I told ya this would happen" and it would be really dark for both of them.
However I don't think this will happen. Either only Amanda dies at the end of the season (the clues are all over the place), or Amanda and Pablo, who would sacrifice himself for Kelly/the group in some "brujo life destiny" manner. And yes, the "dynamic duo" of only Ash and Kelly for the second season (that is before they meet new characters) would be also interesting, but like you said, this character needs to settle down. I'm starting to see Kelly less as someone desperate for vengeance and more as just a crazy sociopat who's a ticking time bomb that will never go off because screenwriting.
I'm wondering if this has something do with what pablo said to kelly about revenge and it consuming ones destiny, they really put a big emphasis on it to not be brought back up again and they have been particular keen on bringing up event's from the past in this show.Pablo even called her out in this episode for acting out towards the demon "I don't think that's gonna work kel...".
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Also, complain about my negativity all you want, but I just need to point out again what I said las week. Apart from the scenes in the bunker, why the fuck is everything happening in daylight, now at least four episodes in a row? Remember the scene where the door opened and nothing was there, then one of the soldiers went to check it out so that Lem could grab him? That scene has absolutely zero atmosphere, because it's FUCKING DAYLIGHT outside the door.
I'm wondering why they are doing this. I understand that it's way more difficult to shoot at night, but... This is Evil Dead, guys.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Hurley said:
Also, complain about my negativity all you want, but I just need to point out again what I said las week. Apart from the scenes in the bunker, why the fuck is everything happening in daylight, now at least four episodes in a row? Remember the scene where the door opened and nothing was there, then one of the soldiers went to check it out so that Lem could grab him? That scene has absolutely zero atmosphere, because it's FUCKING DAYLIGHT outside the door.
I'm wondering why they are doing this. I understand that it's way more difficult to shoot at night, but... This is Evil Dead, guys.
If it makes you feel better, in the inside the world video for this episode they show a shot of the evil force coming towards the cabin and it's at night.
https://www.starz.com/originals/ashvsevildead/video/c9995e1d723c4ab18bac938356193846 (it's right at the very end)
Here's that small clip from the next time from there site in link form, finally figured out were it was.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
I think the fact that the shit can hit the fan at anytime is much more interesting than everything happening at night. Sure atmosphere, and all that jazz... but maybe the evil has grown and/or adapted over time. Hell, I don't know.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Nick el Ass said:
I think the fact that the shit can hit the fan at anytime is much more interesting than everything happening at night. Sure atmosphere, and all that jazz... but maybe the evil has grown and/or adapted over time. Hell, I don't know.
I'm not saying everything should happen at night, but when you think about it, only the first two episodes were setted at night. Everything else happens during daytime without dusk or dawn, which sometimes doesn't even make sense (like the continuity between the fifth and sixth episode). I just think they should be able to play with their surroundings more, that's all.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Hurley said:
Also, complain about my negativity all you want, but I just need to point out again what I said las week. Apart from the scenes in the bunker, why the fuck is everything happening in daylight, now at least four episodes in a row? Remember the scene where the door opened and nothing was there, then one of the soldiers went to check it out so that Lem could grab him? That scene has absolutely zero atmosphere, because it's FUCKING DAYLIGHT outside the door.
I'm wondering why they are doing this. I understand that it's way more difficult to shoot at night, but... This is Evil Dead, guys.
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Kain said:
Hurley said:
Also, complain about my negativity all you want, but I just need to point out again what I said las week. Apart from the scenes in the bunker, why the fuck is everything happening in daylight, now at least four episodes in a row? Remember the scene where the door opened and nothing was there, then one of the soldiers went to check it out so that Lem could grab him? That scene has absolutely zero atmosphere, because it's FUCKING DAYLIGHT outside the door.
I'm wondering why they are doing this. I understand that it's way more difficult to shoot at night, but... This is Evil Dead, guys.
It attacked him in the morning and then when the Sun rose high enough, it retreated. But I agree that it can work even in daytime, I'm just saying that there's just too much of it in the series for my taste. But maybe that's just me.
By the way, did you noticed that aside from two other screenwriters, this episode was also co-wroted by Ivan Raimi?
RE: Ash vs Evil Dead S01 E07: Fire in the Hole Discussion [SPOILERS]
Absolutely. The other thing is that the movies had much smaller settings while AvED takes place in a much more expansive setting in that they move around quite a bit, and to just shoot it all at night would be a waste. New Zealand is a pretty awesome place visually, and I'm sure they want to use that to their advantage in the show even if they are using it as a double for another place.
Oh, and for those still following I believe Kelly's rings spell out hero in this episode... and posted this image to try to win this week. Not that it is a game, but it is quite fun.
